16 September 2012

You want to throw confetti fingerprints

So, clearly my last poll was a bit silly. You don't get to pick and choose what evidence you get when you're investigating a crime.

The person who chooses that, you could say, is the criminal. So perhaps the question should have been 'which of these would you rather leave behind at the scene of a crime, if you were a criminal...'

I'm happy to report that 53% of you would make rubbish criminals. Actually, to be fair, most criminals make rubbish criminals, so perhaps that's not so good!

Anyway, from my perspective, as a copper... Fingerprints, brilliant. Mainly because we have a LOT of them on record, we can take them easily, even out on the street, these days, get a match, make an arrest, fantastic.

Footprints...well, excellent if you leave them. And lots of people do. Because none of us can levitate yet, and very few criminals carry a mop and bucket with them... however, a bit prone to being ruined by others. And we have to catch you to get a match.

DNA...if you're a convicted criminal, we'll have it on record, otherwise, again, we need to get you and take it, and it does take time. But still, a good find at any scene.

However, in the eyes of the law, one of these results is less reliable than the others...


DNA. Yup, it makes it onto every telly programme, and it's all the rage. However, a fingerprint is considered unique. A footprint is considered unique. (And yes, I am talking the sole of a shoe, here, not bare feet!) DNA...it's considered there is a 1 in 1 billion chance that the DNA belong to individual we match it to.

Obviously, we would hardly ever have to go to court with a DNA match alone. Once we have a suspect, there are always more ways to link to them. But out of those three forensic options, DNA is the weakest. Fingerprints and footwear are considered 'conclusive evidence'.

So there you go. Don't tell any criminals.

And give yourself a pat on the back if you picked fingerprints.

And which one of you picked footprints?? Well done!

92 comments:

John H. D. Watson said...

People don't get rid of whatever footwear they've done their crime in? That seems like it would just be common sense.

Greg Lestrade said...

Ah, good old common sense.... yeah, no, oddly, most people wear their designer trainers, that they've probably paid quite a lot for, to do the crimes, and then they keep them. Sometimes they clean them...but yeah, most criminals are fashion victims, it seems. I think they think they can just argue that loads of people buy the same trainers. Which is true, but no two people wear them in the same way.

pandabob said...

I would never have put footprints in there but it makes perfect sense when you explain it. I did go for fingerprints because DNA worries me.

John H. D. Watson said...

I'd say London needs brighter criminals, except, obviously, not very bright ones are to be preferred.

Greg Lestrade said...

AnonyBob - it is definitely easier for your DNA to turn up in a place you've never been than your fingerprints to. But don't let it worry you :)

Danger - I quite like them being not-too-bright, yeah. Although preferably bright enough to know when to give up.

Anonymous said...

I was thinking in terms of being the person investigating/trying the case, not the criminal, which was why I went for fingerprints. My reasons weren't quite right, but I'm happy anyway.

rsf

Greg Lestrade said...

RSF - fingerprints are my preferred evidence-left-behind. Simple to deal with, easier to identify, given our huge databases. And juries like them. They're a very useful thing to find!

Anonymous said...

This is one reason why I went from studying law to studying science.

DNA is more 'unique' than fingerprints or footprints. By a freaking country mile! But the way it's presented in court (by defence lawyers, naturally) makes it sound dubious.

I get quite depressed whenever I read court reports involving DNA. They just don't seem to understand - and that's really the point!

Lawyers bamboozle with statistics and make it seem like DNA evidence is just a bit of guesswork, but when correctly sourced and used it is pretty much bullet-proof!

Greg Lestrade said...

There's quite a good blog about it here:

http://www.defrostingcoldcases.com/forensics/guest-post-what-are-the-chances-interpretation-of-a-dna-match

Anonymous said...

I served on a jury once for a robbery where the evidence that the decision hung on was largely fingerprints and a handprint that would have been nearly impossible to place where it was from the side of the counter where a customer would stand. I was about 19, but because of which chair I was in I wound up being the foreman of the jury. And because I had been a faithful reader of "The Hardy Boys Detective Handbook" I found myself explaining fingerprints to 11 people who were all older than me, but you're right, once they understood them, they really understood them, so there was no question how to decide the case. I've felt a proprietary interest in fingerprint evidence ever since.

rsf

Desert Wanderer said...

Lestrade, why isn't "pilot's seat" an option in this poll? That's definitely the one I'd go for!

Also, in the States, a lot of people besides just criminals have their DNA on file, like military members. Do they not do that there?

Greg Lestrade said...

I just want some sleep.

John, am in the living room playing guitar if my sodding hand works.

Desert Wanderer said...

:( Hope it helps, Lestrade. You, of all people, deserve a decent night's sleep or six.

Anonymous said...

I hope it does work. Just don't go too long.

Would you mind passing along to Mycroft this link? It's for a book of examination questions that would have been given to secondary students in the latter half of the nineteenth century, and I think he might like comparing it to what he has to be able to answer questions about now. Especially since it has Greek and Latin sections.

rsf

John H. D. Watson said...

He's asleep now. On the sofa, cuddling his guitar. Didn't want to wake him, even to get him back in bed, so I just put a blanket over him.

RSF - that exam looks terrifying.

Anonymous said...

Guilty conscience Greg, keeping you awake?

pandabob said...

Did you manage to play your guitar Greg? I hope you did but if not I hope you can soon :-)

Not sure where you are today but I hope you have a productive/fun day whichever is most appropriate :-)

I hope you got some sleep John and that you are having a nice day.

Greg Lestrade said...

Hah, maybe, Anon.

AnonyBob - yeah, for a bit. Which might have been a mistake. Woke myself up by dragging the blanket John had put on me over the strings and scaring the shit out of myself as I still had the headphones half-on.

In court now, after writing up stuff for court all morning a -different cases.

Thanks John.

Anon Without A Name said...

Lestrade - there's an online petition for UK people to sign regarding police pensions, at http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/22321. I think it needs a hundred thousand signatures to get it considered for discussion in Parliament. I hope the police have better luck than the Civil Service...

Hope everyone has a better night's sleep tonight.

PS - Cyprus is gorgeously hot and sunny, worth having to get up at Oh My God o'clock yesterday morning :-p

Anonymous said...

John, it looks scary to me, too, although I think I could answer some of the questions. I think it was a model for teachers to use, not a standardized test in the modern sense, but still... And some of the tests were meant to be administered on Christmas Day! D:

Greg, I hope both guitar and sleep helped some. And that today's court case goes well. I'd sign Nameless's petition, but I don't think I'm on the right continent.

Nameless - Cyprus? I am properly jealous! Have a wonderful time.

rsf

Anonymous said...

Signed the petition, I also work for the government but at least I can strike!

Lancs. Anon

Greg Lestrade said...

Thanks for the link, Nameless. And enjoy the holiday.

Court is going well. Pretty much done, and hopefully a good result. I thnk it's looking good, anyway.

Guitar helped, but I'm feeling it a bit now.

pandabob said...

isn't that always the case Greg, I'm glad it helped though :-)

Great news about court I hope the outcome is correct for you in the end.

Greg Lestrade said...

It was, thank you. I think we all needed that.

Desert Wanderer said...

Well, congratulations, then, Lestrafe. Glad things went your way. Hope you get more sleep tonight.

pandabob said...

Well done to you and your team Greg :-) I'm glad the outcome was correct.

Drinks all round tonight?

Greg Lestrade said...

Yeah, we might go out for one. My days of celebrating until the next shift starts are long gone.

I'm much happier going home these days, hearing what John and Sherlock have been up to, all that.

John H. D. Watson said...

I'm glad court went well, apart from the coffee there I assume.

Greg Lestrade said...

Yeah, don't think that'll ever improve.

You okay? Had a good day?

John H. D. Watson said...

Yeah, pretty good. Quiet, at least until after school. Sherlock had his first kung fu lesson and has been kung-fu-ing things ever since.

Sherlock said...

Can I have this in my room?

http://www.fubiz.net/2012/09/17/fish-tank-phone/

pandabob said...

There is certainly nothing better than going home to those you love but a team building pint never hurt anyone ;-)

Enjoy whatever you do.

Greg Lestrade said...

Errr...no, Sherlock. Although it does look like a fun thing to see.

I think fish tanks are an especially bad idea if you're kung fu-ing everything. But did you enjoy it?

Danger, do you mind if I'm a bit late? I'll do pizza when I'm home if you want?

Sherlock said...

YES PIZZA he said yes I heard him.

I liked it, we got to punch and kick padded things and then hold them for other people to punch and kick and some of the kids are bigger than me and can do it really hard and I'll be able to too.

John H. D. Watson said...

I did actually say yes, don't worry, and pizza sounds very nice. Going out with your team?

Greg Lestrade said...

I'm not sure that makes any sense... but I'm hoping you actually said yes to pizza and not to minding that I'm late.

And yes, drinks with the team. Think we all needed something to go our way. Just hope when they get to sentencing they make it a decent one.

Sherlock, just make sure you only punch and kick padded things, and no people. Learning restraint is just as important as learning how to do the fighting.

Anonymous said...

Sherlock, I want one of those for my room too, but I'm not sure my floor is strong enough to hold up all that water. And I'm not sure how you get inside to feed the fish.

Your class sounds very interesting. Did they show you how to fall down yet? I'm glad they had padded things for you to hit, though, because if you hit hard things you'd end up with a sprained hand like Lestrade.

rsf

Greg Lestrade said...

I'm not sure, but I don't think kung fu teaches you a lot about falling down.

I fear some of my team will learn about it after the session they seem to be setting up for though

Sherlock said...

I could put it in Mrs Hudson's flat because she lives downstairs so it wouldn't fall through anywhere. We didn't fall down but we did a thing where you run but on your hands and feet with your arms behind so you're facing up and we had races like that.

Greg Lestrade said...

There's a basement, SHerlock!

Sorry, bit later than I thought. I'll get pizza. time ran away with me.

Sherlock said...

It doesn't matter if it falls in the basement! Getting pizza is not as good as making pizza.

Greg Lestrade said...

well, it does for security. They probably thought your mum was joking when she said if they crossed her they'd be sleeping with the fishes...

And I'm sorry. but between my hand and two pints of Guinness, any pizza I made wouldn't be a roaring success.

Anonymous said...

I think if it fell through a floor it would break and that would be bad for the fish. And I asked about falling down in kung fu because even though I don't do martial arts, I know that landing right is important when you do fall. I think the crab racing sounds cool. I'm not sure I could do it, though.

Getting pizza is better than making pizza sometimes, but only when you're really hungry and want the pizza right away.

L, I hope your team doesn't all have hangovers tomorrow!

rsf

Sherlock said...

But there would be a lot of water and then it would be like the whole basement was a pond and they always say they're ready for anything so they should be ready for fish.

pandabob said...

how would you go about making a pizza base with one hand? that would be a skill far greater than one handed eggs!

A couple of pints sounds like a decent reward for the successful conclusion of a case:-) have a fun rest of evening with your boys Greg.

Greg Lestrade said...

I have just sent Anthea a text saying 'Are you ready for fish?'

I await a reply.

Annonybob - I would rely on Sherlock wanting to punch the dough back...

John H. D. Watson said...

Has she said anything about the fish yet, or is she ignoring you?

Anon Without A Name said...

RSF - thanks! If it's any consolation, Cyprus has Greek plumbing, which is... less than optimal *shudder*

Lestrade - Ta. Very glad your team got a good result today; a couple of pints of Guinness sounds like the perfect way to top off a case.

Sherlock - I'm quite sure Security are ready for anything, nut I think testing them with Unexpected Fish might be a little uncalled for. Not to mention the damage you'd cause to Mrs Hudson's house.... I'm glad you enjoyed your Kung Fu class :-)

Greg Lestrade said...

Ignoring me, I think.

I've sent her another. "I bichir not angry really. I hake it when you're in a huss. Eel do anything to make it up to you."

John H. D. Watson said...

Ha. Well, if she wasn't ignoring you before...

Greg Lestrade said...

Actually, she didn't ignore that one...

Anonymous said...

Nameless, I've survived Turkish plumbing of the traditional sort, but I was a lot more limber then.

Sherlock, I don't think the basement is watertight, so the water wouldn't stay very long and you'd have to rush around through broken glass to collect the fish.

L, after that last text, I hope you've got something to hide behind!

rsf

Greg Lestrade said...

RSF - SHe just sent back

"I pity Doctor Watson, having to put up with your pollocks."

Says it all, really ;)

John H. D. Watson said...

Ha! Well played, Anthea.

Anonymous said...

*snerk* Very finny!

rsf

Greg Lestrade said...

You wouldn't have me any other way, Doc, and you know it.

I a-dorey you, I flounder without you, you mako me so happy, my plaice is by your side, my sole belongs only to you. This is, as they say, a-moray.

Greg Lestrade said...

By the way, as I've just noticed...

AnonyBob...you win a prize for being the 24,000th comment on this blog.

I actually, literally, cannot believe you lot talk so much! ;) But seriously, that's...well, amazing. 24 thousand comments. I never thought I'd see the day.

pandabob said...

24000 comments is pretty amazing but then you give us a lot to talk about ;-)

I wonder how many have been about murder like this place was supposed to be when the boys set it up!

(the prize of course is a hand splint to stop me typing right?)

Greg Lestrade said...

...it's possible someone may make a congratulatory message for you. I just have to ask him. Be patient.

John H. D. Watson said...

You wouldn't have me any other way, Doc, and you know it.

Very true.

Small Hobbit said...

Hope the day goes well for you today L - remember to look sympathetic to those who seem a little delicate this morning - as I'm sure they would if you were in that state ;)

Greg Lestrade said...

Nne of them are silly enough to be too delicate. Although some are rather bleary-eyed.

Never a good idea to be very delicate when you might have a decomposing body thrust upon you at any moment.

pandabob said...

I'm hoping there hasn't been a decomposing body for you to deal with but I guess it's something you all have to be ready for :-(

Has the day been productive so far? even if only a little?

I hope you're having a good day John :-)

Greg Lestrade said...

Productive, yeah, but currently totally overshadowed by what's happened up in Manchester. My heart goes out to everyone up there -police and families.

pandabob said...

Yep its a mess what's happened there :-(

Anon Without A Name said...

Just caught up with the news from Manchester - what an awful situation :-(

Anonymous said...

I had to google, but I found the news. I'm sorry. John, Sherlock, give Lestrade some extra hugs tonight, okay?

rsf

Greg Lestrade said...

It is awful. Had a bit of a talk with my team. Need to keep a close eye on people times like this.

pandabob said...

I hope you're all alright and it hasn't been too hard a day with all this going on.

Will you be finished on time and home to your boys or are you on the busy end of things today?

Anonymous said...

It is bloody awful. It's always pointless when something like this happens, but then he just turned himself in? He couldn't have done that a couple of hours earlier?

Some days I just hate how freaking senseless life seems to be

Lancs. Anon

Greg Lestrade said...

Not too busy, no, so hopefully. See if Sherlock forgves me for not making pizza yesterday. Try and but him off with something nce.

pandabob said...

I'd bet he's already forgiven you for that and will just be glad to see you and talk your ear off about his day ;-)

Sherlock said...

Why aren't you home yettttttt? John's being boringgggg.

Greg Lestrade said...

I am nearlyyyyyyy hoooooooome.

What's John doing that's so boring? I'd very much like to be being boring with John.

Anonymous said...

Your entendres aren't even double any more, or possibly I need to wash my mind out with soap and water!

Have a good evening all at Chez Holmes-Watson-Lestrade

Lancs. Anon

Sherlock said...

He's just sitting and readingggggg.

And I know what double entendres are but I don't know why what Lestrade said is one.

Greg Lestrade said...

But you like reading!

I can only imagine that Lancs was implying something about..er..boring. And *being* boring. Which are two different things...

Sherlock said...

I like me reading! Him reading is boring!

Greg Lestrade said...

Well I'm nearly home, and I've bought things for quesadillas. Does that sound okay?

Anonymous said...

Mmm quesidillas... Can I eat at your house? My dinner is dull.

rsf

Sherlock said...

Yes! I want hot sauce on mine but not as much as John puts and I made you a surprise.

Greg Lestrade said...

really? Brilliant. Can't wait.

And you can have hot sauce and chillies.

Anonymous said...

Do you ever have sour cream with your quesidillas? I like to add it when I'm using hot sauce.

rsf

Greg Lestrade said...

sometimes.

Sherlock is currently chopping veg.

John is currently having some sort of siezure from laughing so hard.

I am currently trying to remove about half a tonne of glitter from my hair, eyes, clothes, mouth... Sherlock's 'surprise' was glitter and confetti in a bucket on top of the door...

pandabob said...

I have no idea what quesidillas is/are but I'm glad you like the sound of it Sherlock :-)

(you really are lovely making Lestrade surprises)

John H. D. Watson said...

You must admit, the glitter was very surprising...

Greg Lestrade said...

Bloody right it was. And is now spread through the entire flat.

There is glitter on bits of me glitter has no right to be.

John H. D. Watson said...

Going to show me later?

Greg Lestrade said...

Show you? Going to make you clean it off!

Sherlock, is it edible glitter? I ask purely for...err...well, I got some in my mouth. Just wondering :)

John H. D. Watson said...

We don't have any edible glitter! Although if this sort of thing is going to happen often, maybe we should get some.

Rider said...

I admit that when I saw Lestrade's comment about where the glitter had got to I worried it might be a bit like sand in its effects.

So be careful how you clean it off!

Greg Lestrade said...

Welll.... it'll be edible enough, Danger, I'm sure. ;)

Seriously, it's still coming out of my hair, even after washing it. And s just... the whole flat is full of it.

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